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Wade and ft's

 
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Analyze This



Joined: 17 May 2005
Posts: 354
Location: Belgium

PostPosted: Fri Feb 02, 2007 2:28 am    Post subject: Wade and ft's Reply with quote

Is it just me or is Wade really getting a lot of ft's? He's lighting quick and very good so it's normal that he goes a lot to the ft line. But I get the feeling that he is there really a lot more than other players with simular qualities. Has someone numbers on that (for example fta per fga)?
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Jim Raynor



Joined: 11 Dec 2005
Posts: 61
Location: New Jersey

PostPosted: Fri Feb 02, 2007 8:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

82games.com tracks fouls drawn divided by FGAs, which they label DrawF. Wade's DrawF is 0.195, which is very high, even given the fact that he takes a lot of shots in the paint (36% of his FGAs). I haven't put these numbers in a table or anything, but Wade's DrawF is a lot higher than other guards or SFs who drive into the paint a lot, such as Ginobili (0.141), Michael Redd (0.152), Tony Parker (0.108), and Lebron (0.161). However, Wade trails behind Corey Maggette, who has an exceptionally high 0.232.
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mateo82



Joined: 06 Aug 2005
Posts: 199

PostPosted: Fri Feb 02, 2007 10:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's common debate on the internet whether Wade gets preferential treatment of the refs. I don't think this is something you can statistically pin down, though. The best you can do is what Raynor points out, but even then it's impossible to know the reason behind the higher fta rate. It could simply be that he's better at drawing fouls (and/or flopping). Maggette has always been high, but so has Pierce (only .154 this year).
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deepak_e



Joined: 26 Apr 2006
Posts: 334

PostPosted: Fri Feb 02, 2007 12:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think it's a combination of factors. He's a superstar who has respect from the officials. He knows how to sell the foul; similar to Iverson in that respect. And he can penetrate defenses and initiate contact almost at will.
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asimpkins



Joined: 30 Apr 2006
Posts: 178

PostPosted: Fri Feb 02, 2007 5:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I watch him every chance I get, and I don't understand arguments that suggest something strange is going on here. He's got the second highest Usage Rate in the league and he constantly attacks the basket -- and it's not just that so many of his shots are at close range, he's going right at the help defenders to draw the foul. Even at midrange he's good at pump faking and getting the defender off their feet to draw a foul. The results are no surprise.

A lot of fans seem to think that FTA should be handed out evenly, and they just howl about the refereeing if there is a big disparity. But FTA are earned by how you play and how the defense responds.

His critics like to point out the inevitable bad calls that Wade gets in his favor each game. But every star player gets phantom calls, and his critics never seem to be fair on this point. If Wade gets more it's only because he puts himself in that situation more often.
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Tim Lehrbach



Joined: 03 Dec 2006
Posts: 22

PostPosted: Fri Feb 02, 2007 11:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

asimpkins wrote:
I watch him every chance I get, and I don't understand arguments that suggest something strange is going on here. He's got the second highest Usage Rate in the league and he constantly attacks the basket -- and it's not just that so many of his shots are at close range, he's going right at the help defenders to draw the foul. Even at midrange he's good at pump faking and getting the defender off their feet to draw a foul. The results are no surprise.

A lot of fans seem to think that FTA should be handed out evenly, and they just howl about the refereeing if there is a big disparity. But FTA are earned by how you play and how the defense responds.

His critics like to point out the inevitable bad calls that Wade gets in his favor each game. But every star player gets phantom calls, and his critics never seem to be fair on this point. If Wade gets more it's only because he puts himself in that situation more often.


I agree with your post. Beyond sour grapes, there is another reason to complain about Wade, however: his games are nearly unwatchable. If I wanted to see a good game of pinball I'd head to the local arcade.

But I've digressed from the statistical merit of the question...
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Gary C



Joined: 14 Apr 2006
Posts: 46

PostPosted: Sat Feb 03, 2007 12:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Have to agree with the latest replies: he draws so many fouls because he is willing to put himself in a position to draw them. The idea that he is getting preferential treatment over other superstars who just happen to also have much less desire to take contact strikes me as, to use a cliche, people who need to watch a game every now and then.

IOW you can't tell me that if LeBron or Kobe took 30 forays into the lane a game and welcomed whatever resulted they wouldn't be shooting as many FT, I'm just not buying.
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Analyze This



Joined: 17 May 2005
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Location: Belgium

PostPosted: Tue Feb 20, 2007 4:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

82games adressed the issue.

http://www.82games.com/fouldraw.htm
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Harold Almonte



Joined: 04 Aug 2006
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 20, 2007 5:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think it's not his fault he has the athleticism and smartness to take more advantage of the rules than others. But, everybody concern about the bizarre way the last year final championship game became at the end and how damage can this do to ballgame. That was not a fairgame clutch.
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mateo82



Joined: 06 Aug 2005
Posts: 199

PostPosted: Tue Feb 20, 2007 10:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think a statistical analysis of this phenomenon is fruitless. People have complaints about the quality of Wade's fouls drawn, not the quantity. Stats can only tell you how often someone shoots free throws, they can't tell you whether the foul call was correct or not.
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Tim Lehrbach



Joined: 03 Dec 2006
Posts: 22

PostPosted: Tue Feb 20, 2007 10:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mateo82 wrote:
I think a statistical analysis of this phenomenon is fruitless. People have complaints about the quality of Wade's fouls drawn, not the quantity. Stats can only tell you how often someone shoots free throws, they can't tell you whether the foul call was correct or not.


But you can give the benefit of the doubt to the referees and study whether there is any real disparity in the frequency of Wade's trips to the free throw line, as 82games tried to do. I'm not sure what is really revealed by their study, but it was a timely response to all the chatter out there.
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asimpkins



Joined: 30 Apr 2006
Posts: 178

PostPosted: Wed Feb 21, 2007 12:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Another stat that has some relevance to last year's finals...

The Mavs aren't exactly the best team at not fouling on defense. Last year they ranked 19th in opponent's FT/FG and this year they rank 23rd. So this defensive weakness goes beyond Wade -- he was probably just the best player to exploit it. They have a tendency to hack when their defense breaks down.

The Mavs defensive strengths are in denying good shots and denying offensive rebounds. They should take note of the Spurs who do the same two things without committing nearly as many fouls.
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MVP



Joined: 25 Jun 2007
Posts: 77

PostPosted: Tue Jun 26, 2007 4:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
I haven't put these numbers in a table or anything, but Wade's DrawF is a lot higher than other guards or SFs who drive into the paint a lot, such as Ginobili (0.141), Michael Redd (0.152), Tony Parker (0.108), and Lebron (0.161).


I think there's no way you could compare Michael Redd to D-Wade b/c of the difference in speed. Redd isn't one of the quickest NBA players...

I think Ginobili even if he's good at going to the hoop is still not in the same league quickness-wise as Wade is.

I think Lebron is also not as quick as Wade and 0.161 seems to be close to Wade's #... There's simply no comparison to Wade when it comes to quickness..

or wait, there is..Tony Parker Very Happy that's the only out of those player's that I think should be compared to D-Wade when it c omes to getting fouled in the lane (which has a lot to do with how quick a player is)
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